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 Post subject: verdict: best practice charging % max for battery longevity
PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2019 2:31 pm 
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Joined: Sat Apr 11, 2015 2:25 pm
Posts: 16
Have 2015 SEL with 43K miles and was delay charging only to 90% up until car-net subscription expired.
Now immediate charging to 100% on a regular basis using level2 EVSE.
Never used DC fast charge.

Will this impact battery longevity?
How can we see current battery capacity without bringing car to dealership?

Any difference in charging strategy for 2015/2016 vs 2017+ ?

Anyone with a high mileage 2017 - What are you seeing?


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 Post subject: Re: verdict: best practice charging % max for battery longev
PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2019 4:57 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jul 25, 2015 2:24 am
Posts: 806
Location: SoCal
You should avoid leaving the car at 100% charge for extended periods of time, especially in hot weather. Right before my CarNet expired, I had set it so that it always charged to 80%, and for the few times I would need 100% I would go out to the garage when charging was done and hit the timer override button.

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former EV: 2012 Nissan Leaf SV (lease returned)
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 Post subject: Re: verdict: best practice charging % max for battery longev
PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2019 9:38 am 
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Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2015 7:27 pm
Posts: 72
Location: NJ
I went with delayed charging to 90%, assuming hitting the immediate charge button would cause it to charge to 100%. Not so. It does start immediately, then stops at 90%, then it will continue if I start it again.

I haven't charged to 100% in probably two years and thought there might be some pack balancing effect if I charged to 100.

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Mike
Still Plays With Cars - '19 Cooper S vert, '15 e-golf, '04 V70R, '04 FFR, '01 360, '91 318is


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 Post subject: Re: verdict: best practice charging % max for battery longev
PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2019 10:54 am 
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Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2015 2:01 pm
Posts: 2255
The less time the battery sits on a full charge, the better. Avoid DCFC as much as possible, to extend battery life. Your battery never really recharges to 100%, only a Tesla has that capability.

VW has designed the charger pack so that the most level of charge the battery can hold was 22.1 KWh out of a 24.2 kWh battery pack. That's about a 91% charge. VW did this so that the battery will get through the warranty.

The needle on the battery charge gauge has a red zone. Like anything else on a dashboard, that is a gauge, that has red on it, it means STOP! and fix the problem. In this case, the problem is your battery charge is too low, so don't drive the car with the needle in the red zone. Remember, RED means STOP! NOW! and fix the problem. That includes low battery charge, there's a lot of resistance in the battery when the state of charge is so low and you keep depleting it. Resistance creates heat, heat wrecks your battery, so don't go there.

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 Post subject: Re: verdict: best practice charging % max for battery longev
PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2019 2:01 pm 
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Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2015 7:27 pm
Posts: 72
Location: NJ
JoulesThief wrote:
The less time the battery sits on a full charge, the better. Avoid DCFC as much as possible, to extend battery life. Your battery never really recharges to 100%, only a Tesla has that capability.
You repeat that as fact but I've never seen actual data to support it. Do you have a source?

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Mike
Still Plays With Cars - '19 Cooper S vert, '15 e-golf, '04 V70R, '04 FFR, '01 360, '91 318is


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 Post subject: Re: verdict: best practice charging % max for battery longev
PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2019 3:15 pm 
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Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2018 10:45 am
Posts: 107
I think it's fair to say that DCFC wears the battery more than AC charging.

I'm not sure what the comment about Teslas being the only EVs to charge to 100? They don't charge to true 100% either... like all EVs, Tesla restricts the very top portion of the battery to protect it.

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2016 SEL in Deep Black Pearl ⚡️(The Handsome Boy)
2019 SEL in Indium Gray ⚡️ (The Very Handsome Boy)


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 Post subject: Re: verdict: best practice charging % max for battery longev
PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2019 4:14 pm 
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Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2015 2:01 pm
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mfennell wrote:
JoulesThief wrote:
The less time the battery sits on a full charge, the better. Avoid DCFC as much as possible, to extend battery life. Your battery never really recharges to 100%, only a Tesla has that capability.
You repeat that as fact but I've never seen actual data to support it. Do you have a source?


There are 3 sentences there, which one are you looking for data on?

A Lipo battery stores best at 40 to 60% SOC. Anything above or below that shortens the life of the cells in the battery.

Any LiPo battery that is recharged at a less than 1C recharge rate, 1 C being recharged fully in an hour, and less than 1C being recharged at full in less than one hour, is sacrificing convenience and time for long term life of the battery cells.

You'll have to do a search on the Tesla, it has the ability to more fully recharge cells, if you change the settings, but they warn you of what happens to battery life, if you do so.

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 Post subject: Re: verdict: best practice charging % max for battery longev
PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2019 8:02 pm 
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Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2018 10:45 am
Posts: 107
JoulesThief wrote:
You'll have to do a search on the Tesla, it has the ability to more fully recharge cells, if you change the settings, but they warn you of what happens to battery life, if you do so.


It's no different to the e-Golf's ability to cap the charge level using the e-Manager/Car-Net, its just Tesla implements it in a nice, straightforward "maximum charge level" setting. 100% in that setting, though, is not 100% true state of charge, much like 100% on the e-Golf is not 100% true SOC.

I have my e-Golf set to only charge up to 70% unless I override it to charge to 90%. That's just what the Tesla does via a more user friendly UI. I did a lot of searching to try to find some additional "above 100%" setting but I don't see anyone saying that you can charge beyond the upper cap and into the top end buffer.

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2016 SEL in Deep Black Pearl ⚡️(The Handsome Boy)
2019 SEL in Indium Gray ⚡️ (The Very Handsome Boy)


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 Post subject: Re: verdict: best practice charging % max for battery longev
PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2019 9:58 pm 
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Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2015 2:01 pm
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Sparklebeard wrote:
JoulesThief wrote:
You'll have to do a search on the Tesla, it has the ability to more fully recharge cells, if you change the settings, but they warn you of what happens to battery life, if you do so.


It's no different to the e-Golf's ability to cap the charge level using the e-Manager/Car-Net, its just Tesla implements it in a nice, straightforward "maximum charge level" setting. 100% in that setting, though, is not 100% true state of charge, much like 100% on the e-Golf is not 100% true SOC.

I have my e-Golf set to only charge up to 70% unless I override it to charge to 90%. That's just what the Tesla does via a more user friendly UI. I did a lot of searching to try to find some additional "above 100%" setting but I don't see anyone saying that you can charge beyond the upper cap and into the top end buffer.


If you limit each LiPo cell to a maximum of 4.05V per cell, you can extend the life of the battery pack, considerably. Figure out how that's done, and you're at a 90% SOC, as near as I can tell.

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 Post subject: Re: verdict: best practice charging % max for battery longev
PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2019 8:47 am 
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Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2015 7:27 pm
Posts: 72
Location: NJ
JoulesThief wrote:
mfennell wrote:
JoulesThief wrote:
Your battery never really recharges to 100%, only a Tesla has that capability.
You repeat that as fact but I've never seen actual data to support it. Do you have a source?


There are 3 sentences there, which one are you looking for data on?
Is there any evidence that the e-golf battery does not charge cells to 4.2v at 100%? I haven't seen it and I've been reading this form as long as you have.

I can't find a link now but Tesla owners have actually measured 4.2V at 100% in the S/X.

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Mike
Still Plays With Cars - '19 Cooper S vert, '15 e-golf, '04 V70R, '04 FFR, '01 360, '91 318is


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