Tesla - Who said that Electric Cars don't have 'gas' lines

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forbin404

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Dec 20, 2015
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https://mobile.twitter.com/laurenqu/status/813492320980987904

During Xmas weekend at Barstow CA (Which is the link between Los Angeles and Vegas) Tesla owners were waiting up to 2 hours to supercharge their cars
Now didn't we believe electric cars didn't have gas lines? haha (LA - Barstow - 100 Miles) (Barstow - Vegas - 160 Miles)

13 cars waiting 8 chargers (total of 21 cars). Full charge is 70 mins (Assuming that everyone left LA with less than full). Car #17 must be PISSED at having to wait up to 140 mins.

This is not a post knocking Tesla but it will come back to haunt us after we get the 2017 high range vehicles (Golf / Volt) and try to really use that high range.
 
This is exactly why there will be multiple redundant charging spots on I-15 between Victorville and Vegas. As the population of EVs grows, there will need to be multiple sites with multiple chargers in order to avoid long waits.

From their CEC Grant, ChargePoint will be installing 2 DCFC units in the following locations:
- Victorville
- Barstow
- Yermo
- Nipton

There will be a site in Baker with 4 DCFC units. CEC staff leaked in an e-mail that ChargePoint will wait until their upcoming 125kW unit is available and will install those along this corridor as soon as it is UL approved.

NRG also announced that it has started developing a site in Baker for their EVgo network that will get up to 350kW DC Fast Charge units.
 
miimura said:
This is exactly why there will be multiple redundant charging spots on I-15 between Victorville and Vegas. As the population of EVs grows, there will need to be multiple sites with multiple chargers in order to avoid long waits.

From their CEC Grant, ChargePoint will be installing 2 DCFC units in the following locations:
- Victorville
- Barstow
- Yermo
- Nipton

There will be a site in Baker with 4 DCFC units. CEC staff leaked in an e-mail that ChargePoint will wait until their upcoming 125kW unit is available and will install those along this corridor as soon as it is UL approved.

NRG also announced that it has started developing a site in Baker for their EVgo network that will get up to 350kW DC Fast Charge units.
Even with DCFC aren't we talking about 3 hours for 100 miles?
And EVgo is the worst, ever use their website? You can't see anything. So I don't think this 350KW charger will fly.
 
I just drove 100 miles last week. I drove 50 miles at 60 mph on the highway, and I stopped for 30 minutes to get a 22 kW DCFC charge (stopped when the rate started to taper) and then drove another 50 miles at 60 mph. It took me in total about 2 hours and 20 minutes. So not exactly 3 hours, but not too bad. If you want to see EVgo station status, you can use Plugshare. Why won't 350 kW fly? I agree a lot of other technologies need to slot into place to make it work, but I think it's possible. Even being able to charge at 150 kW would be a big improvement over the max rate of 44 kW I can get on the e-Golf.
 
forbin404 said:
Even with DCFC aren't we talking about 3 hours for 100 miles?
And EVgo is the worst, ever use their website? You can't see anything. So I don't think this 350KW charger will fly.
Currently installed 50kW DCFC units like the ABB dual standard unit used by NRG EVgo can fill your e-Golf from 13% to 93% in 30 minutes. I've done it. However, it's only that fast under ideal conditions and starting from that low state of charge. Charging above 80% SOC or when the battery is warm slows down dramatically.

You are correct, the EVgo web site is terrible. Basically the only thing you can do online is give them a new credit card number for your account. You can't see usage, prior bills, nor prior charges to your credit card. That is abysmal. However, they do maintain their chargers and they are building out their network like nobody else (except Tesla).

The 350kW chargers won't provide much additional utility for current vehicles like the e-Golf. The batteries are just too small to take that much power. Those chargers will be good for upcoming cars like the Audi eTron and Porsche Mission-E and others that have big batteries and/or higher voltage battery systems.
 
Glad to see it, but everyone on I-15 is doing 80 to 85mph to get to Las Vegas from Los Angeles, Orange, and San Diego Counties. That's a good way to show up with a hot battery that won't want to take a fast charge at all. I'll pay the diesel premium, buy 6 gallons of Diesel, and do the 280 mile trip, one way, in 4 hours with no stops in my 2014 Passat TDI SE. I don't have that kind of time to wait to recharge on the way.

Plus, you are not supposed to do back to back DC recharges, have to recharge with the J1772 every other charge to give the batteries an equalize recharge.

It would work for other makes that have active thermal management on their batteries, like BMW. But the passive (read "cheap") thermal dissappation system on the E-golf, especially spring, summer and fall on that drive, not so good, it's going to recharge really slow. 15 to 18kwh add rate with the added heat out there, to protect the battery. That big tall thermometer in Baker is there for a reason, to remind you that it's triple digit heat there a lot of the time and well as high double digits.
 
VW is advertising back to back DC charging sessions. See this story on the VW website:

http://newsroom.vw.com/vehicles/road-tripping-from-new-york-to-dc-on-just-electricity/

If VW says it is ok, who are you to say otherwise?

Look, this is a forum for Golf EVs. If you want to praise diesel, it doesn't add to the discussion here. Many of us are early adopters and are willing to take a bit longer to make the trip on American sourced electricity that is getting a larger share of renewable energy every day.

My home electricity is 100% renewable (as is everyone else in my town, thanks to the city utility that switched to wind, solar and hydro last year), so if I charge at home, there is no money going to OPEC or pollution going into the air at the source of the power or when I drive.
 
f1geek said:
VW is advertising back to back DC charging sessions. See this story on the VW website:

http://newsroom.vw.com/vehicles/road-tripping-from-new-york-to-dc-on-just-electricity/

If VW says it is ok, who are you to say otherwise?

Look, this is a forum for Golf EVs. If you want to praise diesel, it doesn't add to the discussion here. Many of us are early adopters and are willing to take a bit longer to make the trip on American sourced electricity that is getting a larger share of renewable energy every day.

My home electricity is 100% renewable (as is everyone else in my town, thanks to the city utility that switched to wind, solar and hydro last year), so if I charge at home, there is no money going to OPEC or pollution going into the air at the source of the power or when I drive.

Seems you have a "green" agenda, whereas I am more focused on transportation needs, regardless of source of energy. Let the readers hear both sides of the story, and form their own conclusions. Don't deny that VW originally designed the e-golf with an active battery cooling system, then, in order to cut costs, scrapped it. They made a cheaper car to compete with the Leaf. There is no evidence yet that they will NOT be having warranty problems with their passive cooling battery system yet. However, there is evidence that the Leaf does have battery problems. I've owned many VW's in my lifetime, I am familiar with the cheap as possible corporate culture of VW at the motherland and in the usa also. VW is a royal PIA at times for getting warranty coverage. You forgot they are not above cheating, to beat the system.


Looks like VW reprinted that as a publicity stunt.

Refer to your owners manual, simply because you can't believe everything you read on the internet.

http://www.torquenews.com/1/why-vw-recommends-using-vw-egolf-battery-sparingly-when-it-comes-fast-charging

HighTestElectrons said:
http://www.torquenews.com/1/why-vw-recommends-using-vw-egolf-battery-sparingly-when-it-comes-fast-charging

"When it comes to e-Golf fast-charging VW has a statement in the owner's manual that every e-Golf driver needs to pay close attention.

VW's statement about DCFC reads: “Requires charging at select DC fast-charging stations. Frequent and consecutive high-voltage charging (including DC charging) can permanently decrease the capacity of the high-voltage battery. See your Owner’s Manual for details." There really isn't much more than that in the big manual. And the warranty doesn't apply if the owners manual is not followed.

Ronald B. Vlack explains in a VW e-Golf group on Facebook.

"The e-Golf battery has no cooling system like Tesla, i3 etc. Only passive cooling to save cost and weight. High speed charging generates lots of heat and heat is the enemy of BEV batteries. That's probably why VW recommends using sparingly and not consecutively. When they announced the change to no cooling, they said their tests showed it wasn't needed, but didn't indicate if the tests included some mix of high speed charging.
 
Every car is different just like every human is different - Leaf problems don't portend e-Golf problems - each car was designed by a whole different group of engineers. There is no evidence that you will NOT be having a heart attack next month. Maybe you should get a heart transplant now since it might fail next month. What kind of twisted logic is this? I have kept track of my battery capacity and after nearly two years of ownership with numerous DC fast charging sessions, some of which were back to back, I don't see any degradation.

What makes you or Ronald B. Vlack an authority on the VW e-Golf when VW itself is encouraging people to take a trip from NJ to DC? Most normal people would read the manual as not always DC charging the car. You have gone to the other extreme - maybe you should drop the 120 V portable EVSE current down to 6 amps so you can be sure you don't damage the battery.

On this forum I read over and over again about e-Golf drivers mentioning fueling their car from solar PV. Yes, it saves money but they are also doing it because it is the right way to power a car, so many of us on this forum have a green agenda. You have an human habitation killing agenda.

Yes, it's a VW publicity stunt because they are trying to sell electric cars - wonderful!

Why do you own so many VWs if you are constantly bitching about their quality, warranty support and customer service? You should get rid of your VWs and stop bitching so much about them - you would be a much happier person.
 
f1geek said:
Every car is different just like every human is different - Leaf problems don't portend e-Golf problems - each car was designed by a whole different group of engineers. There is no evidence that you will NOT be having a heart attack next month. Maybe you should get a heart transplant now since it might fail next month. What kind of twisted logic is this? I have kept track of my battery capacity and after nearly two years of ownership with numerous DC fast charging sessions, some of which were back to back, I don't see any degradation.

What makes you or Ronald B. Vlack an authority on the VW e-Golf when VW itself is encouraging people to take a trip from NJ to DC? Most normal people would read the manual as not always DC charging the car. You have gone to the other extreme - maybe you should drop the 120 V portable EVSE current down to 6 amps so you can be sure you don't damage the battery.

On this forum I read over and over again about e-Golf drivers mentioning fueling their car from solar PV. Yes, it saves money but they are also doing it because it is the right way to power a car, so many of us on this forum have a green agenda. You have an human habitation killing agenda.

Yes, it's a VW publicity stunt because they are trying to sell electric cars - wonderful!

Why do you own so many VWs if you are constantly bitching about their quality, warranty support and customer service? You should get rid of your VWs and stop bitching so much about them - you would be a much happier person.

You should stop quoting misinformation to promote your agenda. VW clearly states not to recharge with DCFC "consecutively". End of story. You should NOT do DCFC recharge sessions back to back, as that would be "consecutive" fast recharges. Wrecking expensive batteries and shortening their life unneccisarily doesn't do the land fill business justice, in terms of pollution, nor does it keep the environment green.

VW's reasoning is sound, the only way to equalize recharge all the cells in the battery pack is when AC charging is introduced that runs the circuitry to balance charge all the batteries in the battery pack. DC fast charging foregoes that procedure, at the expense of saving time, and damaging the batteries a bit for shortened life, for the convenience.
 
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