Volkswagen e-Golf Forum

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 Post subject: Re: Question for 2017-2019 Owners
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 1:13 pm 
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Posts: 102
JoulesThief wrote:
Voltron wrote:
msvphoto wrote:
What is your real world range working out to be?

We love our 2015 so much I am considering a 2017-2019 in addition but curious how much range to expect above what we have now. For example, could I make from Santa Cruz to Mendocino with just one DC fast charge mid way (~225 miles with a couple of hills)?


I seriously doubt it. At typical freeway speeds, the efficiency really drops. During my bay area commute, I find myself averaging 4.4 miles/kWh at an average speed of 35-40 mph. However, at 70 mph, I'm seeing about 3.5 miles/kwh, which translates into a usable range of barely over 100 miles.


As I have stated, many many times before, here, the e-Golf was designed as an urban street city cruiser... not a freeway or an autobahn burner.

Keep it under 40 to 45 MPH and drive it less enthusiastically, as a utilitarian piece of transport equipment, for function, not for fun, and your range expands almost two fold. The Germans designed it for efficiency, not for best or fastest lap times, or racing, or for closed course competition. An e-Golf is not really designed as a driver enthusiast's car, that roll is for the Golf GTI or a Passat SEL with a 3.6 V6.


JT, I have read your opinion on this many times. While I somewhat agree, how do you know what was in the marketing and engineering minds at Volkswagen. None of their marketing material indicates the car is unsuitable for highway use. In fact, allowing the car to reach 85mph and adding DCFC as an option indicates they do intend the car to be used as a car which means highway capable.

All VW Golfs are designed as enthusiast cars. That is how VW has marketed them since the original Rabbit. As a hard core German car enthusiast (6 BMWs, 3 Porsches, and a dozen Audis owned to date) the e-Golf was my first VW and, as an enthusiast, I was immediately smitten. With the low COG, even on crap tires, the e-Golf is a pleasure to drive and handles exceptionally well. I don't hammer it or drive it like I stole it, but I do enjoy the car's capability. Much like I don't floor my 300hp V8 BMW station wagon every chance I get (the gas bill alone would be huge) I can enjoy use of the e-Golf's instant torque from time to time, even with partial "throttle" input.

Our e-Golf is primarily my wife's car. Even still, we are putting somewhere around 80-90% of our total fleet miles on it since we bought it a little over a year ago. (I have a short commute, but lately my wife is driving me to work a couple days a week). The three ICE cars are barely driven anymore and are for range extension and pleasure mostly now. Rethinking the fleet a little bit now.

I am still dreaming of my holy grail EV which would be attractive (and not scream EV) fun to drive from a German car enthusiast POV, have 250 mile range at 75-80 mph in all weather conditions, and cost under $40k new so I could get a 3-4 year old used one for under $20k. May not happen in my lifetime.

It may be that a PHEV like an Audi A3 e-tron makes more sense. The EV only range is enough to get me to work and back and road trip fuel economy is excellent. The problem is, the A3 e-tron is holding resale value way too well to get a deal on a used one. At this rate a used BMW 330e will be less expensive in a year or two (and I am primarily an Audi guy). That was what got me to thinking a 2017-2019 e-Golf used might be a good idea. I think even then I would need an ICE range extender. Maybe an older SUV or pickup I could haul and tow stuff (like a trailerable sailboat) with. The 2000 BMW 540iT wagon fits that bill pretty well, but needs a trailer hitch.

Anyway, thanks to all who replied to this. Sounds like we could make the trip to our friend's ranch we travel to several times a year with two charging stops, one longer AC charge combined with a DC charge. Keep the speed around Hwy 101 speed limit of 65 on cruise control and it might just work. Portland is also becoming a common destination, but Southwest round trip for ~$140 sort of negates the thought of driving there.

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2015 e-Golf SEL my wife's daily, shared on weekends
2000 BMW 540iT my daily and our range extender
1986 Audi 4000 quattro "the cockroach" my alternate daily
1983 Audi Ur Quattro "the garage queen" looks pretty and appreciates daily


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 Post subject: Re: Question for 2017-2019 Owners
PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 9:31 am 
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Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2015 2:01 pm
Posts: 2130
msvphoto wrote:
JoulesThief wrote:

As I have stated, many many times before, here, the e-Golf was designed as an urban street city cruiser... not a freeway or an autobahn burner.

Keep it under 40 to 45 MPH and drive it less enthusiastically, as a utilitarian piece of transport equipment, for function, not for fun, and your range expands almost two fold. The Germans designed it for efficiency, not for best or fastest lap times, or racing, or for closed course competition. An e-Golf is not really designed as a driver enthusiast's car, that roll is for the Golf GTI or a Passat SEL with a 3.6 V6.


JT, I have read your opinion on this many times. While I somewhat agree, how do you know what was in the marketing and engineering minds at Volkswagen. None of their marketing material indicates the car is unsuitable for highway use. In fact, allowing the car to reach 85mph and adding DCFC as an option indicates they do intend the car to be used as a car which means highway capable.

All VW Golfs are designed as enthusiast cars. That is how VW has marketed them since the original Rabbit. As a hard core German car enthusiast (6 BMWs, 3 Porsches, and a dozen Audis owned to date) the e-Golf was my first VW and, as an enthusiast, I was immediately smitten. With the low COG, even on crap tires, the e-Golf is a pleasure to drive and handles exceptionally well. I don't hammer it or drive it like I stole it, but I do enjoy the car's capability. Much like I don't floor my 300hp V8 BMW station wagon every chance I get (the gas bill alone would be huge) I can enjoy use of the e-Golf's instant torque from time to time, even with partial "throttle" input.

Our e-Golf is primarily my wife's car. Even still, we are putting somewhere around 80-90% of our total fleet miles on it since we bought it a little over a year ago. (I have a short commute, but lately my wife is driving me to work a couple days a week). The three ICE cars are barely driven anymore and are for range extension and pleasure mostly now. Rethinking the fleet a little bit now.

I am still dreaming of my holy grail EV which would be attractive (and not scream EV) fun to drive from a German car enthusiast POV, have 250 mile range at 75-80 mph in all weather conditions, and cost under $40k new so I could get a 3-4 year old used one for under $20k. May not happen in my lifetime.

It may be that a PHEV like an Audi A3 e-tron makes more sense. The EV only range is enough to get me to work and back and road trip fuel economy is excellent. The problem is, the A3 e-tron is holding resale value way too well to get a deal on a used one. At this rate a used BMW 330e will be less expensive in a year or two (and I am primarily an Audi guy). That was what got me to thinking a 2017-2019 e-Golf used might be a good idea. I think even then I would need an ICE range extender. Maybe an older SUV or pickup I could haul and tow stuff (like a trailerable sailboat) with. The 2000 BMW 540iT wagon fits that bill pretty well, but needs a trailer hitch.

Anyway, thanks to all who replied to this. Sounds like we could make the trip to our friend's ranch we travel to several times a year with two charging stops, one longer AC charge combined with a DC charge. Keep the speed around Hwy 101 speed limit of 65 on cruise control and it might just work. Portland is also becoming a common destination, but Southwest round trip for ~$140 sort of negates the thought of driving there.


Tell you what... go down to your local VW dealership, and sit down in every different golf model on their show floor that is not an electric car. Tell me what the max speed is,shown on the speedometer, on all those gas and or diesel Golf. Sit in a GTI, sit in an R-32 too if you can find one.

VW does not design cars for the American market, at all, with the exception of the Passats made in Chatanooga, TN, available in North America only. We are an afterthought. VW doesn't give a rat's ass about diamond lanes or HOV's on freeways. They sell the most of these models in the Netherlands and Norway, socialist governments. The car works in the Netherlands because the country is so damn small, that it's citizens forever have been riding bicycles as alternatives to cars. Same with Denmark. Obviously, if you live in a state like California, it's a helluva lot larger than the Netherlands. And it's travel infrastructure is completely different from that of European countries. 85 mph is a suggestion. I know my passat TDI will do 125 mph, and my Touareg TDI will do a buck thirty. Been there, done that, in NV, once, each, in both cars.

Really don't care if you believe me or not, urban city crawler with use of braking regeneration in stop and go is what the e-Golf was designed for and does best. That's hardly enthusiastic driving, in city traffic. They threw an electric motor in a basic car petrol powered platform to build a compromise compliance car. That's exactly what it is, nothing more, nothing less. It's NOT a fully electric integrated, designed from scratch white paper vehicle. It's highly compromised, and adapted, to make the government happy, not you.

The rabbit was not an enthusiasts car.... The Rabbit GTI was. If you ever drove a diesel Rabbit built in Pennsylvania, circa 1979 -1982, you'd know what a dog it was. I owned a 1981 Jetta coupe diesel. It was enthusiastic, only when going down hill, with the help of gravity.

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 Post subject: Re: Question for 2017-2019 Owners
PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:35 am 
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Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2016 11:45 am
Posts: 62
Location: San Francisco, CA
JoulesThief wrote:
msvphoto wrote:
JoulesThief wrote:
urban city crawler with use of braking regeneration in stop and go is what the e-Golf was designed for and does best. That's hardly enthusiastic driving, in city traffic. They threw an electric motor in a basic car petrol powered platform to build a compromise compliance car. That's exactly what it is, nothing more, nothing less. It's NOT a fully electric integrated, designed from scratch white paper vehicle. It's highly compromised, and adapted, to make the government happy, not you.


I'll agree with you that the e-Golf is best used as an urban commuter, but I absolutely disagree with calling it "highly compromised".

As Snoopy says on another thread, the e-Golf is the best car I've ever owned (leased), despite an electric battery being retrofitted onto an ICE chassis. It's all the fun of a Golf without the maintenance worries.

Really the only fault I find with the 2016 SE is the range, which back in 2016 was reasonable compared to other electric cars on the market but now is paltry. I seriously thought about buying out the lease but decided instead to put the money towards an upgrade.

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 Post subject: Re: Question for 2017-2019 Owners
PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 2:17 pm 
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Posts: 372
I have had stoplight drag races with 911s and crotch rockets because this car has so much torque off the line. I don’t care about driving fast on the highway because there is always traffic. I do care about being able to squirt around at low speeds and get out of the way of people driving 25 mph in a 45 zone. The e-Golf corners really well because it has such a low center of gravity and probably would be good at auto cross. The e-Golf’s MQB architecture was designed for diesel, petrol, hybrid, and electric, so this is not an adapted drivetrain stuffed into a gas car.

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 Post subject: Re: Question for 2017-2019 Owners
PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 3:24 pm 
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Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2015 2:01 pm
Posts: 2130
cctop wrote:


As Snoopy says on another thread, the e-Golf is the best car I've ever owned (leased), despite an electric battery being retrofitted onto an ICE chassis. It's all the fun of a Golf without the maintenance worries.



Depends on how many imports you've owned from Germany, and your level of experience in owning and driving them. if it's the first German car you've leased or owned, compared to other cars, then yes, it's probably an upgrade. If all you've owned is VW's/Audi's in various models and platforms, since 1977, almost continuously, Bugs, Transporters, Squarebacks, Jetta's, 5000td's Passat TDI's, and Touareg TDI's in various persuasions, and this is your first electric, it's clear where the DNA genetics came from in the Mk VII Golf, even if it is electric.

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 Post subject: Re: Question for 2017-2019 Owners
PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2019 12:50 pm 
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Just to reiterate, the e-Golf does not have an electric battery being retrofitted onto an ICE chassis.

You can read about the MQB platform here:

https://www.topgear.com/car-news/inside ... b-platform

I'm sure you can read about it other places, too, to discover that the e-Golf was not an afterthought by VW.

Again, the e-Golf is NOT a retrofit. The MQB platform was designed with the e-Golf in mind.

Also, if you want to lose your driver's license by speeding at 85 mph, the e-Golf is more than capable of helping you achieve that goal.

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 Post subject: Re: Question for 2017-2019 Owners
PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2019 9:40 am 
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JoulesThief wrote:
As I have stated, many many times before, here, the e-Golf was designed as an urban street city cruiser... not a freeway or an autobahn burner.
.


The e-Golf drives like a dream on freeways, even at "California Freeway Speeds". The battery will just drain faster, much like an ICE will use more fuel at higher speeds. It's just that ICEs have such baseline inefficiency that they are overall more efficient on the open road than in a city. EVs are inherently efficient so it becomes obvious just how much extra energy is needed to move fast.

Volkswagen says literally nothing about the e-Golf being design as a boulevard cruiser, as JoulesThief has also previously described it. It's clearly not expected to make trips from SF to LA or anything like that, but it is WONDERFUL on the freeway, so long as you're traveling within its range.

The comment about the max speed on the speedometer is ridiculous, by the way. The speedometer in cars never actually gives you real information about how fast the car should be driven. The speedo in my old Honda Fit went up to 130mph. Does that mean Honda believes I should be driving the Fit at 100mph between cities?

There is an upper limit to how much energy that they can pull out of the battery continuously before it will heat up too much for the air cooling to handle. Running constantly at 100mph would drain the battery in lightning speed and would generate too much heat. My e-Golf easily gets up to the 80mph speed threshold but then is software limited to protect the battery. It's not putting undue stress on the system to be driving 65mph on the freeway. Electric motors are far more forgiving than combustion engines. Given how few freeways are at or above 80mph I think it's reasonable to suggest that the e-Golf handles freeways just fine.

My 2016 can make it San Jose to Sacramento with a single DCFC half way, though its definitely pushing the limit of what it can do without trying to chain-DCFC which I'm not comfortable doing.

I regularly head up 280 into San Fransisco from San Jose and the e-Golf keeps up with all the other traffic up the hills and all. Could I make a return trip off a single charge if I took El Camino Real the entire way? Yes, I did it once to see if it was possible. It's not worth it though. It's quicker to just take the freeway and charge in Daly City for 20 minutes, and end up with enough to get home via freeway later.

I feel like JoulesThief's priority is to use the minimal amount of electricity (and by extension spend as little money on fuel) as possible. This would align cleverly with the name JoulesThief. I think if this is the priority then absolutely it would make sense to stay off the freeway. For someone who just wants a car that drives like a car then the e-Golf handles wonderfully and all it takes is a little trip planning. Driving on the freeway isn't really exclusive to "enthusiast" cars like the GTI...


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