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 Post subject: Home Charging - what do I buy?
PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2019 4:11 pm 
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Joined: Sun May 19, 2019 10:06 am
Posts: 13
I went to Hanlees today to check out the e-golf and take a test drive. No one in the dealership could tell me what to do for home charging 240 Volt. They took me over to a ChargePoint outlet and told me "you need to buy something like this for $1,000 and have an electrician install it". I was shocked. $1,000? I am ignorant. We have a 50 amp 240 Volt outlet in the garage and I need to buy something for $1,000 plus an electrician fee and they can't tell me what it is or where I get it or what it does for $1,000?


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 Post subject: Re: Home Charging - what do I buy?
PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2019 5:33 pm 
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Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2018 10:45 am
Posts: 145
Location: Bay Area, CA
okaycoral wrote:
I went to Hanlees today to check out the e-golf and take a test drive. No one in the dealership could tell me what to do for home charging 240 Volt. They took me over to a ChargePoint outlet and told me "you need to buy something like this for $1,000 and have an electrician install it". I was shocked. $1,000? I am ignorant. We have a 50 amp 240 Volt outlet in the garage and I need to buy something for $1,000 plus an electrician fee and they can't tell me what it is or where I get it or what it does for $1,000?


If you already have a 50a 240V outlet your hard work is basically done. You can get ChargePoint or Juicebox (or really any other brand EVSE) that will plug right in for around $500 to $700. Don't spend $700 though. I hear great things about the refurbished JuiceBox 40.

Dealership is clueless and e-Golf can't draw more than 7.2kW anyway (32A at 240V) so the only reason you would need an electrician is to check that your current circuit is safe if you dont trust it. If you wanted to hard wire a charger instead of have it plug into the socket you could get an electrician to do that, but it probably isn't worth it. Just plug it into the outlet and you're good to go.

It seriously sounds like they were suggesting you buy a COMMERCIAL ChargePoint station which is utterly hilarious.

https://emotorwerks.com/store/residenti ... foot-cable

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⚡️2016 e-Golf SEL in Deep Black Pearl⚡️ (The Handsome Boy 1.0)
⚡️2019 e-Golf SEL in Indium Gray ⚡️ (The Handsome Boy 1.1)


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 Post subject: Re: Home Charging - what do I buy?
PostPosted: Sat May 25, 2019 3:36 pm 
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Joined: Sun Apr 21, 2019 12:27 am
Posts: 11
As Sparkle said, you're already half way there with your plug in the garage. Check out Costco, they have a Siemens or Juicebox, best prices, and one or the other is typically on sale and of course Costco's famous service if something goes wrong...


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 Post subject: Re: Home Charging - what do I buy?
PostPosted: Sat May 25, 2019 8:26 pm 
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Joined: Sun May 19, 2019 10:06 am
Posts: 13
Thank you! What does the Chargepoint or JuiceBox actually do? Is it just an adapter? I was reading that you can plug the Leaf Plus right into a 240V outlet without the need for a charging station. I don't need a charging station for the 120 Volt outlet.


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 Post subject: Re: Home Charging - what do I buy?
PostPosted: Sun May 26, 2019 3:25 am 
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Joined: Sat Jul 25, 2015 2:24 am
Posts: 825
Location: SoCal
okaycoral wrote:
Thank you! What does the Chargepoint or JuiceBox actually do? Is it just an adapter? I was reading that you can plug the Leaf Plus right into a 240V outlet without the need for a charging station. I don't need a charging station for the 120 Volt outlet.


This “adapter” you speak of is called an EVSE, which is often incorrectly referred to as a “charger.” It is basically an interface box between your car and the electrical grid. Plug-in cars that are capable of highway speeds need an EVSE to connect to 120 or 240 volt current, it’s not like plugging in an electric lawnmower. Certain 2018/2019 Leaf models come with a dual-voltage EVSE; except for Teslas and these Leafs, the EVSE that comes with any plug-in car sold in North America normally works with 120 volts only, and because that’s very slow is often called a “trickle charger.”

Unlike most electrical appliances, your car (via the EVSE) can communicate with its power source. The EVSE communicates with the car and regulates the flow of electricity. If your car can charge at 30 amps (like any eGolf with the CCS Quick Charge port), but your EVSE can only supply say 24 amps (due to limitations of your own power supply), the EVSE tells the car “I can only supply 24 amps, please don’t try to draw more.” Normally this would not occur with most electric appliances which would draw what it needs even if the circuit can’t handle it. So your car will charge as fast as it possibly can with the particular connection used.

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2015 eGolf SEL (originally leased, bought out lease)
former EV: 2012 Nissan Leaf SV (lease returned)
Range Extender: 2017 VW Golf Alltrack S 4Motion


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 Post subject: Re: Home Charging - what do I buy?
PostPosted: Sun May 26, 2019 8:06 am 
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Joined: Sun May 19, 2019 10:06 am
Posts: 13
Thank you RonDawg. Its an expensive "power adapter" that regulates the power flow to the battery. The interface is built into the little box on the 120V cable just like the power cord of a laptop. Some car companies have chosen to provide one for 240V just like your laptop power cord is good for both voltages. Other models you have to buy the 240V adapter.

If it had been described as a power adapter I would not have had so much confusion. I challenge you to find anywhere this "ESVE" device is described in plain english. Each industry has to make up their own terms that serve to confuse the novice.

Wikipedia: Adapters for battery-powered equipment may be described as chargers or rechargers . AC adapters are used with electrical devices that require power but do not contain internal components to derive the required voltage and power from mains power.


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 Post subject: Re: Home Charging - what do I buy?
PostPosted: Sun May 26, 2019 9:01 am 
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Joined: Fri Mar 27, 2015 4:13 pm
Posts: 1257
Location: Los Altos, CA
okaycoral wrote:
Thank you RonDawg. Its an expensive "power adapter" that regulates the power flow to the battery. The interface is built into the little box on the 120V cable just like the power cord of a laptop. Some car companies have chosen to provide one for 240V just like your laptop power cord is good for both voltages. Other models you have to buy the 240V adapter.

If it had been described as a power adapter I would not have had so much confusion. I challenge you to find anywhere this "ESVE" device is described in plain english. Each industry has to make up their own terms that serve to confuse the novice.

Wikipedia: Adapters for battery-powered equipment may be described as chargers or rechargers . AC adapters are used with electrical devices that require power but do not contain internal components to derive the required voltage and power from mains power.

An EVSE is basically a fancy safety relay. It doesn't do any conversion like a laptop AC adapter.
An EVSE has two main functions.
1. Communicate to the vehicle how much amperage is available.
2. Only pass the AC current to the vehicle connector when a vehicle is actually connected and safe.

The EVSE does not tell the vehicle how much voltage is available, the vehicle has to ask the EVSE to connect the power and measure the voltage. From that information the car can calculate how long charging will take. The actual battery charger that converts the AC power to DC is in the vehicle and the vehicle is responsible to safely and properly charge the battery.

Most EVSE that are properly designed and UL listed are relatively expensive. If you really want to save money, you can find many EVSE from unknown brands on Amazon or eBay that are made in China and have unknown quality and durability.

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2015 e-Golf LE (returned) | 2018 Tesla Model 3 LR | 2012 RAV4 EV Shoreline w/JdeMO | Leviton EVB40 & Jesla Home Charging | 4.32kW Motech/Enphase PV + 2x Powerwall 2 AC


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 Post subject: Re: Home Charging - what do I buy?
PostPosted: Sun May 26, 2019 9:20 am 
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Joined: Tue Dec 15, 2015 10:41 pm
Posts: 98
I have the juice box pro, the thing i hate about it is the size and weight of the cable. I thought it wouldn’t be a big deal but it really is. I also have the tesla mobilencharger it is lightweight easy to use and charges at the same rate. i regret buying the jucebox The 30’amp siemens is just as fast for a 7.2kwh egolf.

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2016 eGolf | 2019 eGolf SE/DAP | Tesla Model S 90D | 6.5 Kw Solar | JuiceBox Pro 40 | Tesla Mobile Charger


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 Post subject: Re: Home Charging - what do I buy?
PostPosted: Sun May 26, 2019 9:30 am 
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Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2015 2:01 pm
Posts: 2295
okaycoral wrote:
Thank you RonDawg. Its an expensive "power adapter" that regulates the power flow to the battery. The interface is built into the little box on the 120V cable just like the power cord of a laptop. Some car companies have chosen to provide one for 240V just like your laptop power cord is good for both voltages. Other models you have to buy the 240V adapter.

If it had been described as a power adapter I would not have had so much confusion. I challenge you to find anywhere this "ESVE" device is described in plain english. Each industry has to make up their own terms that serve to confuse the novice.

Wikipedia: Adapters for battery-powered equipment may be described as chargers or rechargers . AC adapters are used with electrical devices that require power but do not contain internal components to derive the required voltage and power from mains power.



It regulates the current flow, as measured in Amperes. Think of it like water, whether you are flowing 500 CFS or 3000 CFS cubic feet per second. The EVSE acts as a regulator valve to control the amount of current flowing at start up and also when you disconnect, so that you don't get huge sparks and burn up the handle and charging port contacts. It chokes down the current flow (Amps) at start up of connection, and also it chokes down the current flow when you disconnect the charger handle, so you don't get big, burning, zappy sparks flying everywhere melting the metal contact points.
It also is a limiting device to prevent the wiring in your house from getting too hot and burning the house down. Again, it does this by sensing and limiting the amount of current that's allowed to flow to the big battery on your e-Golf.


Plug your hair dryer in and set it on low fan with no heat, and unplug it from the socket, and note the size of the spark at the plug, Now do the same with the heat on high and the fan on high, and unplug it from the wall socket. The spark is much bigger. It does more damage to your plug and socket, the bigger spark or larger arc. That's what an EVSE prevents.

Make sure your garage jack is a dedicated 50 amp circuit line wired with 6 ga wire, and that it has a 14-50 NEMA outlet, like for RV camping, and not a 6-50 outlet, which is quite common in shops with big arc welders and such.

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 Post subject: Re: Home Charging - what do I buy?
PostPosted: Sun May 26, 2019 5:05 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jul 25, 2015 2:24 am
Posts: 825
Location: SoCal
okaycoral wrote:
Thank you RonDawg. Its an expensive "power adapter" that regulates the power flow to the battery. The interface is built into the little box on the 120V cable just like the power cord of a laptop. Some car companies have chosen to provide one for 240V just like your laptop power cord is good for both voltages. Other models you have to buy the 240V adapter.

If it had been described as a power adapter I would not have had so much confusion. I challenge you to find anywhere this "ESVE" device is described in plain english. Each industry has to make up their own terms that serve to confuse the novice.

Wikipedia: Adapters for battery-powered equipment may be described as chargers or rechargers . AC adapters are used with electrical devices that require power but do not contain internal components to derive the required voltage and power from mains power.


That's not a good analogy because an EVSE is really not a transformer, which is that that "little black box" does for your laptop or many other electrical appliances.

A better explanation as to what it does was already given above. Here's a simplified version from a well-known (in the EV world) EVSE manufacturer: https://www.clippercreek.com/what-is-an-evse/

Video explanation of what an EVSE is and what the different levels of charging mean:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DE-kl-91Huc

_________________
2015 eGolf SEL (originally leased, bought out lease)
former EV: 2012 Nissan Leaf SV (lease returned)
Range Extender: 2017 VW Golf Alltrack S 4Motion


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